[kdejute]

For what it is worth, personally, I would be tempted to use UEB's composite symbol for horizontal juxtaposition (GTM §14.3.4) but would probably not use it, trusting the braille user to recognize the significance of two sequential equals symbols without my grubby little transcriber hands getting into the content.

14.3.4 Horizontal Juxtaposition ;=
"Horizontal juxtaposition" is to be invoked only when two symbols are written in close proximity and it is clear from the usage that a new single symbol, distinct from the elementary symbols considered in sequence, is intended. Otherwise, symbols written one after the other should simply be brailled accordingly.

If you had an example to share, Shellee, I would love that because the committee could come to a decision for that specific circumstance.

–Kyle

[kdejute]

P.S. I noticed you quoted a sentence from a course, and I think there is a different interpretation than you assigned to it. The sentence is, "Linked expressions are displayed expressions that are made up of an 'anchor' and one or more 'links'." I believe the sentence means "linked expressions can be displayed" rather than "if something is a linked expression, then it is necessarily displayed."

[kdejute]

Thank you for sharing more of your thoughts.

The committee has been discussing this, and our conclusions are summarized below:

1. The fact that these expressions are itemized removes the need to treat them as displayed. [see BF2016 §9.1.2, which says, "For formatting purposes, lists, boxed material, and tables are not considered displayed material. ..."]
2. Only the comparison symbols require spacing.

So, we recommend using the indention pattern and lack of blank lines that make up your Example 1.

And, we would probably omit all the spaces we could. I think that means keeping only two kinds of spaces: 1) spaces around symbols of comparison and 2) spaces that make a word more likely to keep its usual form. This is illustrated in a snippet below and in slightly more context in the attached picture and brf.

"7 .- t5?s"/.- t5?s

The big takeaway is that an itemized list is not displayed material.

As for spacing, the best choice is likely what you can best do consistently.

Braille on!
–Kyle

 

 

• This reply was modified 6 months, 2 weeks ago by kdejute. Reason: adjusted wording explaining which spaces to keep

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[kdejute]

It is indeed the end of an era.

[kdejute]

Janice, Computer Braille Code is no longer an active code in the United States. Please see the document BANA Positions on Computer Braille Code and Braille ASCII.

Does that lead you to further questions, or is that all you need?

–Kyle

[kdejute]

Last, but not least, you asked, "Wouldn't the enclosure symbol be easier to understand when preceded by the shape termination symbol?"

I cannot say whether that would be easier to understand. However, I can point out that section 14.3 is titled "Combined shapes," and its first paragraph says that physical enclosure takes two symbols and makes a new, previously undefined symbol. For example, the "circled plus" is a single entity with a meaning all its own that is distinct from the "plus" and the "circle." So, the enclosed shape is part of the overall shape, and it would be inappropriate to put a shape terminator between the circle and whatever is enclosed.

I think the next necessary question is, "Does physical enclosure accurately transcribe the meaning of 'circling' in print (like "circle the correct answer")? ... Or would a typeform perhaps do a better job of transcribing the meaning of 'circling' while physical enclosure should be reserved for situations where the enclosing and enclosed shapes become something different from either (like the circled plus described above)? I do not have an answer to that question, and I suspect no one else does for sure either, for now.

Thank you for sharing your astute questions!

Please let us know if you need anything more or different.

–Kyle

[kdejute]

Third, if we need to indicate "circling" (that is, physical enclosure in a circle) of a symbols-sequence that consists of more than one item, then yes, using braille grouping indicators is a good solution.

The example you shared is a simple up pointing arrow and a dollar sign circled together:

;;$=[<\+@s>

That symbols-sequence is a grade 1 word indicator, the two-cell symbol for a circle (shape indicator and a full cell), the physical enclosure cell, opening braille grouping indicator, the two-cell symbol for a simple up pointing arrow, the two-cell dollar symbol, closing braille grouping indicator, and then space.

[kdejute]

Second, if we have to show a transcriber-defined symbol enclosed in a circle, I agree that the following would be the best way to do so (using "physical enclosure" as illustrated in GTM §14.3.1).

;;$=[?

That symbols-sequence is a grade 1 word indicator, the two-cell symbol for a circle (shape indicator and a full cell), the physical enclosure cell, the first transcriber-defined symbol, and then space.

You have likely already considered all angles of:

• using the transcriber-defined symbol vs. the transcriber-defined shape
• with what words you will identify whatever transcriber-defined thing you use
• where you will identify whatever transcriber-defined thing you use (i.e., on the Special Symbols Page or in a list of special symbols within the text)

I do think this would be understood by a 10th grade student. 😊

🧠

Finally, does the termination of a shape leave the rest of the symbols-sequence in grade 2 (unless it is affected by a grade 1 word or passage indicator)? ...  Many agree with your assessment that according to RUEB2024 §2.5.3, it does. However, the first example in GTM §14.3.1 might indicate otherwise.

RUEB2024 §2.5.3 says, "Grade 1 mode exists only when introduced by a grade 1 indicator or by a numeric indicator."

The first example in GTM §14.3.1 is: ;$=["6 (circle enclosing a plus sign) where the cell dots 2-4-6 does not have any grade 1 indicator or numeric mode affect it, BUT it is treated as if it has its grade 1 meaning (physical enclosure). Maybe the argument is that what's physically enclosed is part of the shape and so affected by the shape indicator's limited grade 1 mode (though that would be quite a unique effect for an indicator to have).

This issue is on the list of things to be clarified by ICEB's technical material code maintenance committee. Right now, I would follow RUEB2024 §2.5.3, as you have suggested.

🧠

[kdejute]

First, if you use only a checkmark to indicate a checkmark-within-a-circle, I would likely applaud your choice to simplify where appropriate. The explanation of this checkmark usage should go on the Transcriber's Notes Page. It would probably be appropriate to identify the checkmark itself on the Special Symbols Page, but the use of only a checkmark where print shows a checkmark inside of (or on top of) a circle, is a braille formatting choice and so belongs on the Transcriber's Notes Page. (BF2016 §3.1.1's second paragraph and RUEB §3.28)

–Kyle

[kdejute]

Oooh! These are intriguing and clever questions! I will try to respond to them one at a time. –Kyle

[kdejute]

Thank you for your question! Before we respond in full, could you please share two clarifying pieces of information?

First, what is one specific lesson manual or code book that says, "nested linked expressions are displayed material"?

Second, what is your reasoning for having blank spaces in some places but not in other places (e.g., between the word "tenths" and the symbol ÷ but not between the symbol ÷ and the underscore)?

–Kyle

[kdejute]

Thank you for asking. We use GTM 7.9 rather than GTM 12 when §12 does not include the specific modifier we need. A right-pointing arrow is covered in §12, so we should follow the guidelines there.

–Kyle

.=^: simple right-pointing arrow over previous item

[kdejute]

Second, using UEB for it, we would transcribe a bidirectional arrow over AB as follows:

;;<,,ab>.9\wro

You were close. We do need a grade 1 word indicator to start. We do need braille grouping indicators around AB so that the modifier applies to both letters and not just to B. And, your bidirectional arrow is good. \wro

Because UEB does not classify "bidirectional arrow over" with the common modifiers in GTM §12, we should look to GTM §7.9 and use the indicator for "expression directly above." .=.9

Then the arrow does not need any terminator or braille grouping indicators because its start and end are clearly delineated by the arrow indicator and an arrow terminator, respectively. .=| and .=o

Phew.

Braille on!

–Kyle

• This reply was modified 7 months, 3 weeks ago by kdejute. Reason: tried to make simbraille all the same size

[kdejute]

First, yes, it is correct to use the two-cell capital letter indicator in front of AB rather than capital A capital B. [Chemistry has different preferences, because its capital letters each mean a totally different element.]

[kdejute]

So, for example, "BC bar" (or "bar over BC") would be transcribed in UEB Math/Science as follows.

;;<,,bc>:

And, "(line segment) AB = (line segment) CD" would be probably be transcribed as follows.

;;;<,,ab>: "7 <,,cd>:;'

–Kyle

P.S. The DBT codes I would use to get that transcription above are ts e bar e bar te (also in the attached screenshot).

• This reply was modified 7 months, 3 weeks ago by kdejute. Reason: capitalized letters in simbraille

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