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I have to be able to see a picture of actual page. This is true for both of your questions. You have scanned to .rtf and that just shows the TEXT. I need to see the image. That means you need to scan to either .jpg or .pdf or some other image format. Are youa ble to do this?
This is a complicated question and I want to be sure to give you accurate information. In order to do that I need to be able to see what the page actually looks like, not just the text. In addition, I think the actual page has been altered in the .rtf because I see a layout that is quite unusual and expected. It is also inconsistent. I need an actual image.
Please let me know if this is a problem for you.
–Joanna
Our Contractor has asked one more question about this. On the graphics in the Glossary it has the
Spanish word such as altura/height. I read a post in which you said that the new guidelines would take out the spaces by the slash in all languages. Should she do that at this point or follow the specs as they are written? Also, Contract the English word Height? Thanks so much.OK, fifth cell headings makes sense for that first section. Do you agree about the second part with long phrases and their translations being placed in 1-5, 3-5?
As for the last section, I thought I understood your advice to be:
,’Column form changed as follows:
First Column
Second Column,’French word/phrase: English translation (blocked in cell 1, ignore typeface)
Example sentence (blocked in cell 3, emphasize the french word/phrase in the example sentence)Is this correct?
Rebecca
Thank you very much for your advice and clarification that not all printed columns should be transcribed as braille “columned material”. I am still trying to get a sense of when I should maintain a columnar relationship, versus rearranging in some other format.
Could you address the first two print column sections on the page I sent earlier? Am I right in interpreting the first section as related columns, and the second section as text with translations (1-5, 3-5)? I have attached a .brf with my best guess at formatting this print page.
Also, is there an errata sheet containing modifications to the Interim Manual? I would like to make sure I have the most up-to-date guidelines.
Thanks!!
RebeccaOn the vocabulary list and illustrative sentences at the bottom of the page– Section 71b in the Interim Manual has been modified. This type of vocabulary list has a colon inserted between the foreign language and the English translation. Do no use two spaces–just a colon with one space after it. Ignore special typeface that designates language. This is also in the new rules under review and is authorized for use by BANA at this time. Understand that this might be ultimately changed when the new rules are published, but it is valid now.
I changed my mind about columns. This is not a table, but it is useful to treat it as related columns. Use stairstep with the vocabulary word and translation in cell 1 (there won’t be any runovers) and the appropriate sample sentence blocked in cell 3. See page 77 in Braille Formats. You can refer to first column and second column in the transcriber’s note, since there aren’t column headings here.
–Joanna
Forgot to thank you for including the print. Expecially when trying to determine context, it’s very important to see the whole thing!
–Joanna
1. Yes that is correct. The determining factor is language context. This is just a proper noun mentioned in passing, as it were, and those French words are not being studied here. Context.
2. This is harder to explain. Even though the French is surrounded by English, the context here is still French. It’s easier to see context in the bold French words in the text above because those words are actually being analyzed and studied. But in this sentence I believe the context is still French and the print provides the special typeface. I would use the emphasis and treat this phrase as French–no contractions and use accented letters.–Joanna
Thanks for your patience. This page has complex formatting issues to it that I have been considering. I do appreciate the print page that you sent. It’s essential for understanding what you are working with and the precise nature of the questions you are asking. I’m going to answer in two parts.
First we’ll try that middle section regarding the plural article des. You have referred to it as being in columns. This is not columned material. It looks like columns because it happens to be printed that way, that’s all. For purposes of braille formatting this material is neither useful, nor easily read in columns. These are long sentences. What you want to do is to arrange them so that the full sentence can be easily read and the comparison of the article forms is quickly accessible to the reader.
The singlemost difficult issue in foreign language braille is translation and the shifting of one language to another, especially in close proximity. It is easy to visually identify each language and easy for the print reader to see when a shift it made from one language to the other. This is not true in braille and so a number of formats are used to show language shift that include usage of special typeface and the actual formatting of the material. You have described one of these methods with regard to tranlations that are too long for a single braille line. This is NOT a good usage here for these comparison sentences. That format tells the reader translation is taking place and the reader will be poorly served by wasting time discovering that nothing is being translated. Do not use that format here. And these these are not columns, so don’t do that.
These sentences are actually examples and should be treated as displayed material. Each pair of sentences is treated as an example with a blank line between. Use 1-3 and appropriate typeface emphasis of the article.
Il achète du vin.
Il n’achète pas du vin.Je mange de la viande
Je ne mange pas de viande.The second part of my response will be regarding the translated list and sentences at the bottom of the page that you have referred to as a table. This is not a table, but two lists. There are competing formats here because at least one of these lists is a translated vocabulary which also has formatting requirements. I’ll present suggestions for dealing with in the second part.
–Joanna
The rules you refer to are Braille Formats and since we are looking at Formats rule, this question is posted in the wrong place. This needs to be over in Formats. But since it’s here, I’ll answer it here.
This is a foreign language in an English context and that is why it doesn’t belong here. Rule 6 tells you to use the braille for the inverted queston mark and exclamation. Do that and list in Special Symbols. Since this is 3rd grade I would suggest that you identify these as inverted (upside down) question marks/exclaamation point to make the language more appropriate.
As you have noted, Rule 1 says to use the dot 4 for the accented letters. I don’t understand what you mean about combining these rules. They are two separate rules that address two separate issues. Rule 1 addresses the accented letters (use dot 4) and Rule 6 addresses the puncutation. There is nothing to combine. Use Rule 1 where it applies, use Rule 6 where it applies.
The foreign language rules apply to foreign language textbooks. This is not a foreign language textbook, is it? And the issues you have here are addressed in Braille Formats. That’s why these rules are even IN Braille Formats. Braille Formats is about how to do braille in a textbook. The foreign language rules in Braille Formats are about how to do foregn language that appears in non-foreign language textbooks. (And of course translated glossaries are different because the context changes.)
Hope this helps.
–Joanna
You have done a fine job of sorting through the various issues that this pages presents. I do have a couple of concerns and suggestions to address those.
On the monkey (Canta) item, please note that there is a clear difference between a picture description and a picture caption. The monkey picture has no captions and therefore must be described in a transcriber’s note. The colons that you have do not belong there. Colons are part of the format used for captions. So, the TN here should read like a TN, which are the transcriber’s words added to the text. The description needs to be clear enough for someone who can’t see the page. Your description, two monkeys jumping and two monkeys sitting is fine for someone who can see the page. But this does not tell the blind reader WHICH monkeys are sitting and WHICH monkeys are jumping. It does not even tell the reader how many monkeys there are. I would describe this by saying that there are four pictures of a monkey. The first and third pictures show the monkey jumping and the second and fourth pictures show the monkey sitting. No colons. Keep the TN indicators.
On the Aprende item, I note that you have handled the caption correctly. The purpose of the colon is to make it very clear to the reader that this is a caption of words PRESENT IN PRINT. That is why the colon is so important. No TN indicators here, which is correct, because this is not a transcriber’s note. The description follows as a TN with indicators. That’s a great description that I’m sure the reader will find helpful.
On the Escucha item–This is a tricky formatting situation that you have handled very well. However, I am concerned about the English picture words on the same line as you have. The English words are NOT in the print and are, in fact, added by the transcriber. That makes them transcriber’s notes, which you have correctly enclosed in TN indicators. However, there it NO provision anywhere for a TN to be located any place other than 7-5. Therefore, these TN’s CANNOT be on the same line. I would place the TN’s on the next line in 7-5.
–Joanna
Well look at that and right you are. I would just follow print here. Compound hyphen for the opening quote puncutation double dash for missing word.
[braille]336—- puso otro
–Joanna
