kdejute

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  • in reply to: DBT codes #38917
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Susan,
    Together, we found some useful reminders and DBT tools! For future reference, a brief summary of what came out of our email exchange is below.
    We must remember to use braille grouping indicators to limit the effect of a bar over previous item indicator when necessary. (See webinar "Decimals, Including Repeating Decimals")
    We used the following DBT codes in Word when preparing a file for DBT (Duxbury Braille Translator). Code "names" are my personal designations, not official names.

    • fs – fraction start ... We used this to code the start of any fraction (numeric or general; it works for both).
    • fl – fraction line ... We used this between any fraction's numerator and denominator.
    • fe – fraction end ... We used this to code the end of any fraction.
    • ts – technical start ... We used this to get a grade 1 passage indicator.
    • te – technical end ... We used this to get a grade 1 terminator. The ts and te code pair seems to sometimes repress grade 1 indicators between them.
    • g1 – grade 1 ... When paired with g2, we used this to suppress grade 1 indicators when we did didn't need them (because numeric mode had already turned on grade 1 mode).
    • g2 – grade 2 ... We used this paired with g1 to enclose material in which we chose to suppress grade 1 indicators.
    • : – protect group start ... We used this paired with ; to enclose material that we wanted to stay all together on one braille line.
    • ; – protect group end ... We used this paired with ; to enclose material that we wanted to stay all together on one braille line.
    • e – begin modified expression ... We used this to code the start of any material that is modified by having something (e.g., a bar) directly over it.
    • bar – bar over (I think) ... We used this after the modified expression (e.g., "63" in the example below) to code what thing was modifying the modified expression
    • ac – We used this before the "bar" code when we needed to get braille grouping indicators to limit the effect of the bar over previous item indicator.

    For fun, here are some of the symbols-sequences we were working toward.</p>
    #dj/aa "7 #c4<#fc>: 3.63 with a single bar over "63"</p>
    ;;;(a./b)"6(c./d)
      "7 (ad./bd)"6(bc./bd);' “‘fraction a over b’ plus ‘fraction c over d’ equals ‘fraction ad over bd’ plus ‘fraction bc over bd’”

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 11 months ago by Chris Clemens.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 11 months ago by Chris Clemens.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 11 months ago by kdejute.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 11 months ago by kdejute.
    in reply to: More questions #38895
    kdejute
    Moderator

    You're quite welcome.

    Braille on!
    –Kyle

    in reply to: More questions #38892
    kdejute
    Moderator

    It is *very* understandable that you have more questions, especially after shifting from UEB with Nemeth!

    Some responses to your questions:

    1.

    You *should* use 5-5 for directions. There should *not* be a blank line between a cell-5 heading and directions.

    The fourth paragraph of #3. General format in BANA's Provisional Guidance for Transcribing Mathematics in UEB says, "For directions preceding itemized materials, use margins 5-5. If there are additional paragraphs, use margins 7-5. For directive sentences that precede material that is not itemized use margins 3-1." Beyond the GTM and the BANA guidance, our formatting guide for UEB Math/Science transcriptions is Braille Formats 2016, whose Example 10-2 shows NO blank line between a cell-5 heading and directions that follow.

    For Duxbury, if you insert the DBT code "skn" as the first thing within the Directions paragraph style, that should get rid of (or "nullify") the skip line you're getting between the heading and the directions. Please let me know if you have questions about how to insert a DBT code.

    2.

    As you said, yes, definitely you need both the parentheses (which appear in print) and the general fraction indicators (which indicate print arrangement).

    So, the braille I would use for the print you describe is:

    #e"<(y"-#b./#d)"> "7 ;m

    3.

    There will be! A thoughtful group in Canada is working on a UEB Math/Science version of BANA's UEB-with-Nemeth Graphing Calculator Guidelines.

    I appreciate that's not helpful to you right now. For what it's worth, my understanding is that the philosophy of the UEB-with-Nemeth Graphing Calculator Guidelines is being followed for the UEB Math/Science version, and most of the changes are simply to use UEB symbols instead of any Nemeth Code symbols.

     

    Thank you for the questions! I look forward to more!

    –Kyle

    in reply to: Subscripts #38889
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Wow, Susan! I commend you for continuing to explore your resources after posting here, and I'm so glad you found useful information in the short webinar "Grade 1 Mode Preferences" that is part of our Webinars Archive.

    Braille on!
    –Kyle

    in reply to: down tack #38833
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Deborah,

    We have been discussing this. ["We" is the NBA Nemeth Code for Math and Science Committee.]

    The Nemeth Code does not include a symbol specifically for the "tee" or "down tack" sign. So, it must be "represented by the use of one or more letters suggestive of the name of the shape being represented." We cannot use _% $t _: or even _% $d _:, because these are the Nemeth Code symbols for "triangle (equilaterial)" and "diamond," respectively.

    For the "down tack" or "tee" sign, we might use _% $dt _: or perhaps _% $tee _: and, of course, we must identify the symbol and describe the print sign it represents in a transcriber's note or listing on a special symbols page (NC1972 §107).

    So, I might transcribe "w with superscript ⊤" as _% w^$tee _: And, I might transcribe a longer expression, like "g(x)superscripted ⊤(Df)" as
    _% g(x)^$tee"(,df) _:.

    Thank you for asking (complete with a Wikipedia link). Braille on!

    –Kyle

    in reply to: Numeric Indicator on a number line #38780
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Melissa,

    Currently, there are two separate examples of number lines in the BANA Guidelines for the Transcription of Early Educational Materials from Print to Braille.

    On print page 46, there is a sample transcription of a number line for a UEB Math/Science transcription; that number line DOES have numeric indicators.

    On print page 80, there is a sample transcription of a number line for a UEB with Nemeth transcription; that number line does NOT include any numeric indicators.

    In general, as Guidelines and Standards for Tactile Graphics (GSTG) tells us, the numeric indicator should be omitted when depicting number lines (especially below the number line).

    Based on my understanding of coming updates to the GSTG, I think you are fine to not use the numeric indicators. Please let me suggest that 1)  you do not use a numeric passage around any number line and 2) you do explain on the Transcriber's Notes page that labels below number lines are transcribed without numeric indicators.

    –Kyle

    in reply to: UEB technical question #38663
    kdejute
    Moderator

    I understand your question is about a specific item in the CNIB course UEB Technical. Please allow me to address subscripts and superscripts generally in UEB Math/Science and not just the one item in a course of practice items.

    ABC

    One way of looking at sub- and superscripts is to talk about three spaces in print. There is space "A," which is the symbol on the baseline. There is space "B," which is the space immediately to the right of A. And space "C" is the space to the right of B. ABC

    Transcribing simultaneous sub- and superscripts

    Simultaneous sub- and superscripts happen in space B.

    If print shows simultaneous sub- and superscripts, then we transcribe first the subscript and then the superscript. (GTM 7.7)

    Transcribing non-simultaneous sub- and superscripts

    Non-simultaneous sub- and superscripts have one script in B and another in C. In other words, the sub- and superscript are not in print stacked on top of each other in the same space immediately following the baseline letter (or other symbol).

    If print shows a superscript in space B and a subscript in space C, then we know to break from the standard order and transcribe first the superscript and then the subscript. We expect the braille user to recognize this break from standard order and so get the information that print gives by putting the superscript in space B and the subscript in space C.

    Here's the tricky bit. If print shows a subscript in space B and a superscript in space C, then a braille transcription that follows print without any grouping indicators would look just like the transcription of a simultaneous sub- and superscript.

    So, in order to give the braille user the information that print is giving by using non-simultaneous sub- and superscripts, we group the baseline symbol and the subscript and transcribe the superscript following that group.

    I hope that helps! Please let me know if it is unclear in any way.

    –Kyle

    in reply to: Barred Bracket Symbol #38572
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Raymond,

    To the best of my knowledge, there is not a UEB symbol for barred brackets (which look like they have an extra vertical bar right next to the vertical line of the square bracket; aka, "mathematical white square brackets"), shown as ⟦ and ⟧ in print.

    Before anything else, we must ask, "Are these brackets the only ones used in the print?" If so, then our job is easy. Just use the regular UEB square bracket and explain the change from print in a transcriber's note at the beginning of each volume. (Braille Formats 2016 §2.6.1.d)

    If print uses both regular square brackets and barred brackets, then I believe you will have to use a transcriber-defined symbol for the left barred square bracket and another transcriber-defined symbol for the right barred square bracket. Rules of UEB §3.26 discusses transcriber-defined symbols.

    Please let us know if you have follow-up concerns or questions.

    –Kyle

    in reply to: Spatial problem with dollar Signs #38510
    kdejute
    Moderator

    A note about the horizontal line at the end of the problem: Depending upon where you are transcribing or who you are transcribing for, you may need to treat it differently. For example, in Alberta, the horizontal line (or sum line) would begin in the first column after the plus symbol; in other words, the operation symbol stands out. Please be consistent in however you treat your horizontal lines and operation symbols.

    in reply to: Spatial problem with dollar Signs #38508
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Chris,

    Thank you for your question!

    Yes, I believe we would transcribe the question as you describe.

      @s#c4fj
    "6@s#b
    "33333333

    Attached is a picture of the above along with what I guess your print looks like ($3.60 over +$2 with the $2 not aligned with the $3 in print).

    You and I and members of the NBA UEB Technical Material Committee are all inclined to align the problem's components in a mathematically logical way, with the 2 tucked nicely under the 3.

    A word of WARNING though: If the components of the problem are not aligned in print, and you have reason to believe that is intentional, then you should follow the print. In other words, if the goal of the exercise is for the learner to identify alignment issues and proceed appropriately, then we need to reproduce the weird alignment in braille.

    I hope this helps as you journey on in UEB Math/Science!

    –Kyle

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    in reply to: Graphing Calculator #38506
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Please let me redirect you to the Nemeth Code for Math and Science forum of Ask an Expert. Would you be so good as to repost your question there?

    in reply to: Numeric Indicator use in long division #38383
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Raymond,

    Thank you for sharing your question.

    First, please let me suggest indicating the red numbers in a transcriber's note instead of by scattering typeform indicators throughout the vertically aligned long division problem. Such a note might say,

    "In the following problem, some numbers and operation symbols are printed in red. The red color is not shown in braille. The list below tells what is printed red in each braille line.

    • 3rd line, number 4
    • 5th line, −11
    • 6th line, 3
    • 7th line, 20
    • 8th line, −5"

    The reason I suggest the transcriber's note instead of typeform indicators is that using the typeform indicators will significantly impact the alignment of the problem, and the concept being illustrated by the typeform is alignment.

    Alternatively, you could transcribe the problem twice–once where the red is not shown and a second time where the red is shown within the problem. This repetition is inspired by Braille Formats 2016 §13.9.3 and would need to be explained in a transcriber's note.

    If you do use typeforms within a numeric passage, it is our understanding that you would not have to repeat a numeric indicator after a typeform symbol indicator or even after a typeform word indicator, because the numeral following the indicator is still in a numeric passage and so could not be misread as a letter.

    For more discussion of typeforms, especially within Math and Science materials transcribed using UEB, please see our webinar Typeforms (from September 24, 2020), which is available to NBA members in the Webinars Archive.

    Braille on!
    –Kyle

    in reply to: Calculator problems #38308
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Lynette,

    I am so sorry to hear that!

    As for the calculator examples you shared, it looks like square shapes will work very nicely for the "keycharts." I am not sure what to recommend for print's empty double low line. Maybe the visible space (⠬ dots 346) with the transcriber-defined typeform you've used for the double underline applied to it?

    That would have the first example keychart and the first empty keychart looking something like this:

    ⠸⠆⠼⠃⠚⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠪⠐⠦⠀⠸⠆⠼⠉⠚⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠪⠐⠶⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠪⠐⠌

    ⠀⠀⠸⠆⠼⠋⠚⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠪⠐⠶⠀⠈⠼⠆⠼⠁⠚

     

    ⠨⠤⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠀⠨⠤⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠀⠨⠤⠀⠰⠫⠼⠙⠀⠈⠼⠆⠬

    There may be an argument to be made for using the underline tyepform with a visible space instead of the underscores.

    What do you think of all that?

    –Kyle

     

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    in reply to: Calculator problems #38280
    kdejute
    Moderator

    In case it is helpful, below are some thoughts on transcribing calculator material using UEB.

    • As you say, GTM 3.5 advises us to use the underline indicator and a transcriber's note instead of the shape enclosure indicators that are covered in GTM 14.3.
    • When underlining is used in the surrounding text, perhaps a transcriber-defined typeform may be useful (Rules of UEB section 9).
    • You *could* transcribe commands and symbols enclosed in shapes.

    "Experimental" transcriptions are in the attached files.

    What do you think?

    –Kyle

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    in reply to: Calculator problems #38240
    kdejute
    Moderator

    Lynnette, I'm afraid your attachment did not come through. Could you try again? (If it still does not show up, it may need to be compressed in order to meet the Ask an Expert file size limits.)

Viewing 15 posts - 46 through 60 (of 483 total)